Birthright citizenship, widely considered settled law before Trump tried to overturn it via executive order last year, escaped this term unscathed by one single vote. Peter, Rhiannon, and Michael explore the various mental illnesses, brainworms, and ahistorical nonsense that led to such a close decision.

5-4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Alli Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations. Transcriptions of each episode are available at fivefourpod.com

Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.

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In honor of America’s birthday, join Peter, Rhiannon, Michael and University of Pennsylvania Law Professor Kermit Roosevelt as they talk through how the Supreme Court greased the wheels for the end of Reconstruction and the rise of Jim Crow.

Check out Kermit’s book The Nation That Never Was: Reconstructing America’s Story.

Thank you to our wonderful subscribers!

5 to 4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Allison Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations.

Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Rhiannon interviews Lisa Graves – right‑wing influence expert, former Justice Department official, co‑host of Legal AF, and founder of True North Research – about her latest book, Without Precedent: How Chief Justice Roberts and His Accomplices Rewrote the Constitution and Dismantled Our Rights.

Check out Without Precedent here!

Thank you to our wonderful subscribers and fellow Roberts haters.

5 to 4 is presented by Prologue Projects. This episode was produced by Allison Rodgers. Leon Neyfakh provides editorial support. Our website was designed by Peter Murphy. Our artwork is by Teddy Blanks at Chips NY, and our theme song is by Spatial Relations.

Follow the show at @fivefourpod on most platforms. On BlueSky, find Peter @notalawyer.bsky.social, Michael @fleerultra.bsky.social, and Rhiannon @aywarhiannon.bsky.social.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.